Note: This text has been automatically extracted via Optical Character Recognition (OCR) software.
Brother Sadler's Answer To Bro. Jacob Norton's
BROTHER SADLER'S ANSWER TO BRO . JACOB NORTON'S
" COMMENTS ON FACTS AND FICTIONS . " ( Continued from page 3 . ) IN the concluding portion of Bro . Norton's " Comments " he has alluded to my " good-natured effort of transforming Dermott and his seventy or more associates of 1751 and 1752 into Masonic saints . " Now , I am not
going to quarrel with him over his little flutter of imagination , hut 1 take this opportunity of assuring him that good r . ature had nothing whatever to do with my endeavours to put a new complexion on the question of the " Origin of
the Ancient Grand Lodge , " and , between ourselves , I am inclined to think he has paid me an undeserved compliment , for I very much fear that good nature is not one of my
strong points . It is not an easy task to identify motives for one ' s own actions , but if 1 have been at all influenced by sentiment , I think it not unlikely that a love of truth and justice had something to do with my undertaking .
From the very beginning of my Masonic studies I could never quite reconcile myself to the popular and accepted version of the " Origin of the Ancients . " The whole story bristles with inconsistencies , which no previous writer has
explained away , at any rate not to my satisfaction . For the first ray of light I am indebted to my much-esteemed friend and brother Jacob Norton , of Boston , U . S . A . May I indulge in the hope that henceforth he will remember
this fact , and that it will be the means of inducing him to view with a more favourable eyo the theory for which , although unintentionally , he is in some degree responsible . Doubtless this will be news to him , but with his wonderful
memory I shall have no difficulty in making him understand my meaning . Some years ago , when Bro . Norton was engaged in a controversy with Bro . Hughan or some other Masouic writer , he requested me to search the Graud
Lodge records for information bearing on the subject then under discussion , and in so doing I came across the following item in the Minutes of llth Derember 1735 : — " Notice being given to the Grand Lodge that the Master and
Wardens of a Lodge from Ireland attended without , desiring to be admitted by virtue of a Deputation from the Lord Kingston , present Grand Master of Ireland . But it
appearing there was no particular Recommendation from his Lordship in this affair , their Request could not be complied with unless they would accept of a new Constitution here . "
I copied this item and sent it in my next letter to Bro . Norton , with an intimation that I thought it possible that this incident had something to do with the origin of the '' Ancients . " My correspondent probably did not see
anything in it , for he made no reply to my suggestion ; however , he will know from the lapse of timo since the correspondence I have alluded to thafc this theory of mine is not simply an idea of rapid and recent growth ; and I am
perfectly satisfied that had Bro . Norton or any other of our historians the same facilities for acquiring information , and had given as much consideration to this particular subject as I have , he would have been as convinced as I am
of the Irish origin of the Ancients , that no secession worthy of the name ever occurred iu the history of English Masonry , and that the only branch of the fraternity to
whom the term " Schismatics" can with propriety be applied is the body of malcontents who associated with Preston in his abortive attempt to establish a schismatic Grand Lodge in the latter part of the last centnry .
Now , although Bro . Norton is absolutely silent on this non-secession theory , which really occupies about threefourths of the book he has been criticising , he has said that he believes Heseltine ' s description of the Ancien's ,
notwithstanding the evidence I have adduced as to its incredibility , and the indisputable fact that the letter he refers to was written with no other object than to depreciate a successful rival Society ; hence , I may assume that he
does not accept my theory , for if he believes Heseltine and Preston's version it is quite evident he cannot believe mine . I wish particularly to have Bro . Norton ' s opinion on the Irish evidence contained in Chapter V . of " Masonic
Facts and Fictions , " but before he gives it it is only fair that I should mention that I do not imagine there is nothing more to be said , either for or against my views and the evidence set forth in the chapter indicated . The more I learn , and the more I think about this matter , the
Brother Sadler's Answer To Bro. Jacob Norton's
more firmly convinced am I that the theory I have offered is the only feasible solution of a question which has puzzled all onr most thoughtful writers . I have never met with this incident of the refusal to admit the Irish Masons to
Grand Lodge in print until it was mentioned in Gould's History , and although the author does not appear to attach particular importance to it , he says— " It is a little singular that in 1735 , whilst this nobleman was at the head of the
Craft in Ireland , the Master and Wardens of an Irish Lodge were refused admission to the Grand Lodge of England ' unless '—to quote from the records— ' they would accept of a new Constitution here . ' " * It will be seen that there
exists a slight verbal difference between Bro . Gould s description aud my extract from the records , for the former reads thus— " the Master and Wardens of an Irish Lodge , " while the latter reads— " The Master and Wardens of a
Lodge from Ireland . " Now , I always thought this very singular , and I thus refer to it on page 127 of " Masonic Facts and Fictions , " " bearing in mind the fact that the
nobleman mentioned had only a few years hefore ( 1728-9 ) presided over their own Grand Ledge with much eclat , and had also made them several valuable presents ; this proceeding seems as churlish , as it was certainly
shortsighted , on the part of the ' regulars . ' Private Lodges would , of course , take their cue from the Grand Lodge , and refuse to open their doors to these strangers whose working was different to theirs . "
" Does any one at all familiar with the characteristics of an Irishman imagine that 'Pat' would meekly submit to such treatment ? If he does , I most decidedly do not . It seems to me much more likely that he would call some
of his countrymen about him and open a Lodge on his own account , or 'by virtue' of the before mentioned Deputation or Warrant , for we must remember that ' exclusive Masonic hirisdiction' was unknown at this period . One
Lodge would , of course , beget others , and so it probably went on until unconstituted Masonic Lodges became the rallying points or centres of union of nearly all the Irish mechanics and labourers that came over to seek
employment in the English metropolis . " The migratory character of this class will , I think , sufficiently account for the comparatively small number to be found on the register afc the formation of their Grand Lodge , also for the rapid
growth of their provincial and military Lodges . " This was my opinion in 1887 ; since then I have read something which has induced me to review this subject , and although it has not led to any material alteration of opinion it has
opened up fresh ground and furnished additional food for reflection . In The Cabinet History of England , written by Charles Macfarlane and published by Blackie and Son , on p 31 , Vol . 16 , will he found the following
paragraph" The gin mobs were not yet tranquilized , and other riots were caused in London by the employment in the Spitalfields looms of a number of poor Irish who had come over to moiv
and reap , but who had engaged to help to weave silk at tioothirds of the ordinary ivages . " I may observe thafc the writer of the foregoing paragraph is describing the condition of London and the difficulties of the Government in
the year 1736 ; and when viewed in conjunction with the incident of the llth December of the previous year , it appears to me to furnish a very probable explanation of the action of the Grand Lodge ; that is supposing these
strangers to have been merely travelling Masons , or " sojournei's " as they would then be called ; popular prejudice would doubtless not be without its effect on the
officials , but even this does not satisfactorily account for the alternative , " unless they would accept of a new Constitution here . "
In referring to tho early records of the Grand Lodge of England , on page 22 of " Masonic Facts and Fictions " I have said— " every line is worthy of careful consideration , aud that there is evidently more in these transactions than
appears upon the surface , ' and it seems to me that these words are especially applicable to the record I have just quoted . At first sight the impression left on my mind was that the passage referred to the Master and Wardens of an
Irish Lodge , i . e ., a Lodge in Ireland , but further consideration has resulted in my putting another construction upon it , viz .: that these brethren were officers of a Lodge then
actually meeting in London " by virtue of a Deputation ( or Dispensation ) from the Lord King-sto-i , " who , as before stated , was a Past Gtand Master of England , and I should say deservedly popular during bis Grand Master-
Note: This text has been automatically extracted via Optical Character Recognition (OCR) software.
Brother Sadler's Answer To Bro. Jacob Norton's
BROTHER SADLER'S ANSWER TO BRO . JACOB NORTON'S
" COMMENTS ON FACTS AND FICTIONS . " ( Continued from page 3 . ) IN the concluding portion of Bro . Norton's " Comments " he has alluded to my " good-natured effort of transforming Dermott and his seventy or more associates of 1751 and 1752 into Masonic saints . " Now , I am not
going to quarrel with him over his little flutter of imagination , hut 1 take this opportunity of assuring him that good r . ature had nothing whatever to do with my endeavours to put a new complexion on the question of the " Origin of
the Ancient Grand Lodge , " and , between ourselves , I am inclined to think he has paid me an undeserved compliment , for I very much fear that good nature is not one of my
strong points . It is not an easy task to identify motives for one ' s own actions , but if 1 have been at all influenced by sentiment , I think it not unlikely that a love of truth and justice had something to do with my undertaking .
From the very beginning of my Masonic studies I could never quite reconcile myself to the popular and accepted version of the " Origin of the Ancients . " The whole story bristles with inconsistencies , which no previous writer has
explained away , at any rate not to my satisfaction . For the first ray of light I am indebted to my much-esteemed friend and brother Jacob Norton , of Boston , U . S . A . May I indulge in the hope that henceforth he will remember
this fact , and that it will be the means of inducing him to view with a more favourable eyo the theory for which , although unintentionally , he is in some degree responsible . Doubtless this will be news to him , but with his wonderful
memory I shall have no difficulty in making him understand my meaning . Some years ago , when Bro . Norton was engaged in a controversy with Bro . Hughan or some other Masouic writer , he requested me to search the Graud
Lodge records for information bearing on the subject then under discussion , and in so doing I came across the following item in the Minutes of llth Derember 1735 : — " Notice being given to the Grand Lodge that the Master and
Wardens of a Lodge from Ireland attended without , desiring to be admitted by virtue of a Deputation from the Lord Kingston , present Grand Master of Ireland . But it
appearing there was no particular Recommendation from his Lordship in this affair , their Request could not be complied with unless they would accept of a new Constitution here . "
I copied this item and sent it in my next letter to Bro . Norton , with an intimation that I thought it possible that this incident had something to do with the origin of the '' Ancients . " My correspondent probably did not see
anything in it , for he made no reply to my suggestion ; however , he will know from the lapse of timo since the correspondence I have alluded to thafc this theory of mine is not simply an idea of rapid and recent growth ; and I am
perfectly satisfied that had Bro . Norton or any other of our historians the same facilities for acquiring information , and had given as much consideration to this particular subject as I have , he would have been as convinced as I am
of the Irish origin of the Ancients , that no secession worthy of the name ever occurred iu the history of English Masonry , and that the only branch of the fraternity to
whom the term " Schismatics" can with propriety be applied is the body of malcontents who associated with Preston in his abortive attempt to establish a schismatic Grand Lodge in the latter part of the last centnry .
Now , although Bro . Norton is absolutely silent on this non-secession theory , which really occupies about threefourths of the book he has been criticising , he has said that he believes Heseltine ' s description of the Ancien's ,
notwithstanding the evidence I have adduced as to its incredibility , and the indisputable fact that the letter he refers to was written with no other object than to depreciate a successful rival Society ; hence , I may assume that he
does not accept my theory , for if he believes Heseltine and Preston's version it is quite evident he cannot believe mine . I wish particularly to have Bro . Norton ' s opinion on the Irish evidence contained in Chapter V . of " Masonic
Facts and Fictions , " but before he gives it it is only fair that I should mention that I do not imagine there is nothing more to be said , either for or against my views and the evidence set forth in the chapter indicated . The more I learn , and the more I think about this matter , the
Brother Sadler's Answer To Bro. Jacob Norton's
more firmly convinced am I that the theory I have offered is the only feasible solution of a question which has puzzled all onr most thoughtful writers . I have never met with this incident of the refusal to admit the Irish Masons to
Grand Lodge in print until it was mentioned in Gould's History , and although the author does not appear to attach particular importance to it , he says— " It is a little singular that in 1735 , whilst this nobleman was at the head of the
Craft in Ireland , the Master and Wardens of an Irish Lodge were refused admission to the Grand Lodge of England ' unless '—to quote from the records— ' they would accept of a new Constitution here . ' " * It will be seen that there
exists a slight verbal difference between Bro . Gould s description aud my extract from the records , for the former reads thus— " the Master and Wardens of an Irish Lodge , " while the latter reads— " The Master and Wardens of a
Lodge from Ireland . " Now , I always thought this very singular , and I thus refer to it on page 127 of " Masonic Facts and Fictions , " " bearing in mind the fact that the
nobleman mentioned had only a few years hefore ( 1728-9 ) presided over their own Grand Ledge with much eclat , and had also made them several valuable presents ; this proceeding seems as churlish , as it was certainly
shortsighted , on the part of the ' regulars . ' Private Lodges would , of course , take their cue from the Grand Lodge , and refuse to open their doors to these strangers whose working was different to theirs . "
" Does any one at all familiar with the characteristics of an Irishman imagine that 'Pat' would meekly submit to such treatment ? If he does , I most decidedly do not . It seems to me much more likely that he would call some
of his countrymen about him and open a Lodge on his own account , or 'by virtue' of the before mentioned Deputation or Warrant , for we must remember that ' exclusive Masonic hirisdiction' was unknown at this period . One
Lodge would , of course , beget others , and so it probably went on until unconstituted Masonic Lodges became the rallying points or centres of union of nearly all the Irish mechanics and labourers that came over to seek
employment in the English metropolis . " The migratory character of this class will , I think , sufficiently account for the comparatively small number to be found on the register afc the formation of their Grand Lodge , also for the rapid
growth of their provincial and military Lodges . " This was my opinion in 1887 ; since then I have read something which has induced me to review this subject , and although it has not led to any material alteration of opinion it has
opened up fresh ground and furnished additional food for reflection . In The Cabinet History of England , written by Charles Macfarlane and published by Blackie and Son , on p 31 , Vol . 16 , will he found the following
paragraph" The gin mobs were not yet tranquilized , and other riots were caused in London by the employment in the Spitalfields looms of a number of poor Irish who had come over to moiv
and reap , but who had engaged to help to weave silk at tioothirds of the ordinary ivages . " I may observe thafc the writer of the foregoing paragraph is describing the condition of London and the difficulties of the Government in
the year 1736 ; and when viewed in conjunction with the incident of the llth December of the previous year , it appears to me to furnish a very probable explanation of the action of the Grand Lodge ; that is supposing these
strangers to have been merely travelling Masons , or " sojournei's " as they would then be called ; popular prejudice would doubtless not be without its effect on the
officials , but even this does not satisfactorily account for the alternative , " unless they would accept of a new Constitution here . "
In referring to tho early records of the Grand Lodge of England , on page 22 of " Masonic Facts and Fictions " I have said— " every line is worthy of careful consideration , aud that there is evidently more in these transactions than
appears upon the surface , ' and it seems to me that these words are especially applicable to the record I have just quoted . At first sight the impression left on my mind was that the passage referred to the Master and Wardens of an
Irish Lodge , i . e ., a Lodge in Ireland , but further consideration has resulted in my putting another construction upon it , viz .: that these brethren were officers of a Lodge then
actually meeting in London " by virtue of a Deputation ( or Dispensation ) from the Lord King-sto-i , " who , as before stated , was a Past Gtand Master of England , and I should say deservedly popular during bis Grand Master-