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  • The Freemasons' Monthly Magazine
  • Nov. 7, 1863
  • Page 7
  • CAN A WARDEN INITIATE, &c. ?
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The Freemasons' Monthly Magazine, Nov. 7, 1863: Page 7

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    Article CORRESPONDENCE. ← Page 2 of 2
    Article CAN A WARDEN INITIATE, &c. ? Page 1 of 2 →
Page 7

Note: This text has been automatically extracted via Optical Character Recognition (OCR) software.

Correspondence.

and promise not to offend in such manner in future ; and I would advise it to establish its claim by paying over the funds of the spurious to the genuine Masonic Institutions , and commence de novo , with a determination to secure for itself a position of charitable Masonic benevolence worthy of the lodge , the town , and the province . I would suggest , on this being adopted , the Secretaries

of the various charities should acknowledge the receipts by letter through your columns , and that your able pen should be employed in smoothing down asperities , and ,, in the name of all Masons , grant a full and free absolution , accompanied with your patriarchal blessing . So would end , in a pleasant manner , creditable to all parties , what might otherwise . remain a source of grief and dissatisfaction . I am , yours fraternally and truly . October 27 th , 1863 . AN OM MASON .

TO THE EDITOR OP THE FREEMASON'S' MAGAZINE AUD aiASOSTC IHRROH . DEAR SIR AND BROTHER , —In reply to "P . M ., " whose letter appeared in the number for October 24 th , I beg to say that I was not actually or apparently pub forth as ¦ a scout . " P . M . " has alluded to me under the signature I appended to my note , and it is quite as far from my wish as it can be to his to bandwords with him .

y My forbearance teaches me to overlook his rudeness , but I claim to call things by their right names with ¦ quite as much vigour as he does , and it appeared to me that Lodge 600 and its Treasurer had been , and still are , treated very unfairly . As a London brother , never having been in the town in which Lodge 600 meets , knowing no brother who is ,

or ever was , to my knowledge , one of its members , I can he no scout—no tool of those of whom I know nothing . My signature expressed my feelings on the matter , and I can only regret that a brother can be found who fieems desirous of withholding from those who conscientiously differ from him that which should be extended to both sides of a question . FAIR PLAY .

Can A Warden Initiate, &C. ?

CAN A WARDEN INITIATE , & c . ?

TO THE EDITOR OP THE PREEStASOUS JTAGAZIJTE AUD 3 IASOUIO MIRROR . DEAR SIR AND BROTHER , —Bro . William Blackburn ' s questions aud assertions , intended to be looked upon as unanswerable , prove too much for his case . In " 161 . 6 , there were two Masonic jurisdictions in England . That at York—thc elder sister—styled the Grand Lodge of ¦ all England , had lodges , holding under it , sparsely

scattered throughout the land , whilst the other ruling power was an occasional aud fitful Grand Master in the South , having no Grand Lodge , but regarded by various isolated lodges as their head . The regulanions of these two systems were as widely different as their respective governments . The Union in 1813 did all that Bro . Blackburn claims

for it , and something more into the bargain , when it proceeded to " alter , repeal , and abrogate all past regulations , " yet retaining as one of its fundamentals the principle enunciated by the Southern Grand Lodge , in 1723 , " that it is not in the power of any man , or body of men , to make innovation in the body of Masonry : " so that even Bro . Blackburn must admit that to " alter ,

repeal , and abrogate all past regulations" was as great an innovation , aud thorough clean sweep , as any body of men could possibly make either iu the body or spirit of Freemasonry . Of course , a different individual cannot answer Avhether another is sure or not about any point unless they have compared notesbut Bro . Blackburn treats the

, Athol and York lodges as synonymous , and actually places the junior first . The York lodge was founded about A . D . 928 , and the Athol lodges were York lodges , but never termed so until the Duke of Athol accepted the Grand Mastership o £ tho " Ancient Masons" in the

year 1772 , and resigned it to the Duke of Kent on the 1 st of December , 1813 , in order that the latter should , iu his turn , abdicate to the Duke of Sussex on the following St . John ' s day , the 27 th of December , in the same year . Bro . Blackburn cannot be complimented on his knowledge of comparative philology , for the word " Warden" is

nob Anglo-Saxon , or Saxon , but pure low Dutch , waerden , " a keeper , a guardian , a head officer , " and in no one ease does his definition of an irresponsible head apply to a Warden , who was the chief executive officer under the head . Old Oowel tells us that "the Warden of the Cinque Ports is a magistrate of those havens in the east of England , called the Oinque Ports , who has there all

that jurisdiction which the Admiral of England has in places not exempt "—and this was by no means , at any time , to be likened to the kingly power . Without entering into the question of what the "Book of Constitutions" indicates as to the duties and privileges of Wardens—one sentence by Bro , Blackburn disposes of his entire argument . He writes , " Where a Fellow Craftsman is chosen Warden of the work under

the Master , he shall be true both to Master and Fellows , shall carefully oversee the work in the Master ' s absence , " & c . " Here , " says Bro . Blackburn , " is nothing about taking an apprentice only as to ' the management of the Craft in working , ' id . est , work already in hand ; and in that sense only may a Warden rule a lodge at the present day . " Surely Bro . Blackburn ' s gloss on the passage

above quoted is fatal to his argument , for if a Warden has the power to complete the work already in hand , he must be able to initiate . An imaginary case , but founded on those of daily occurrence , will show how untenable Bro . Blackburn ' s doctrine is . A lodge is summoned—the W . M . is absent , it then falls to the lot of one of the Wardens to preside . There is an initiation , a passing , and

a raising , to be performed . Well , says Bro . Blackburn , he can'ttake anapprentioe ; all he can do is to rule the lodge as far as the work already in hand goes . But the work in hand comprises conferring the second and third degrees , and does Bro . Blackburn mean to say a Warden can admit brethren to an equal status with himself , oiS . ce of course exceptedand not be able to receive a candidate ?

, Is there any secret that a W . M . can communicate to an E . A ., F . C , or M . M . that caunot be done as well by a Warden of equal ability ? Or , again , to what can an installing W . M . or P . M . allude when he says , in his address to the Wardens , " in his [ the newly installed W . M . ' sJabsence you will succeed to higher duties ; your

attainments , therefore , should be of such a nature , that the brethren may not suffer for want of proper instruction . " And what instruction is half so proper or profitable to the brethren of a lodge than to see the three degrees performed ? Therefore , if a Warden can pass and raise brethren to superior degrees , it is a manifest absurdity to contend he cannot confer the first aud lowest degree .

Bro . Blackburn then quotes the following declaration : — " The Grand Lodge al « ne has the inherent power of enacting laws and regulations for the government of the Craft , and of altering , repealing , and abrogating them ; ahvays taking care that the ancient landmarks of the Order be preserved . " He then adds , " I call upon the members of Grand Lodge to take that care . " "Our

duty is not to inquire what wove the practices in 1646 , 1682 , 1725 , or any period anterior to the ' solemn act of union between the two Grand Lodges of Freemasons of England , in December , 1813 , but to transmit to our successors the ancient landmarks of the Order , ' and ' the laws and regulations for the government of the Craft , ' and unsullied as we have received them . "

pure Granting Bro . Blackburn ' s citation to be correct ,- as an extract , how can the ancient landmarks be preserved if they have been , as he tells us at the beginning of his letter they were , —altered , repealed , and abrogated ? If we are not to inquire what they were , how can we observe them ? Or in what maimer cau they be transmitted pure

“The Freemasons' Monthly Magazine: 1863-11-07, Page 7” Masonic Periodicals Online, Library and Museum of Freemasonry, 23 May 2025, django:8000/periodicals/mmr/issues/mmr_07111863/page/7/.
  • List
  • Grid
Title Category Page
MOTHER KILWINNING. Article 1
MASONIC SAYINGS AND DOINGS ABROAD. Article 2
MASONIC NOTES AND QUERIES. Article 4
CORRESPONDENCE. Article 6
CAN A WARDEN INITIATE, &c. ? Article 7
THE LUXURY OF FREEMASONRY. Article 8
ON THE CHRISTIANITY OF MASONRY. Article 8
THE ANTIQUITY OF MASONIC DEGREES. Article 8
Untitled Article 9
THE MASONIC MIRROR. Article 10
METROPOLITAN. Article 10
PROVINCIAL. Article 10
ROYAL ARCH. Article 16
KNIGHTS TEMPLAR. Article 16
CHANNEL ISLANDS, Article 16
Obituary. Article 17
Poetry. Article 18
DO THE THING THAT'S RIGHT, FRIEND. Article 18
THE WEEK. Article 18
TO CORRESPONDENTS. Article 20
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Note: This text has been automatically extracted via Optical Character Recognition (OCR) software.

Correspondence.

and promise not to offend in such manner in future ; and I would advise it to establish its claim by paying over the funds of the spurious to the genuine Masonic Institutions , and commence de novo , with a determination to secure for itself a position of charitable Masonic benevolence worthy of the lodge , the town , and the province . I would suggest , on this being adopted , the Secretaries

of the various charities should acknowledge the receipts by letter through your columns , and that your able pen should be employed in smoothing down asperities , and ,, in the name of all Masons , grant a full and free absolution , accompanied with your patriarchal blessing . So would end , in a pleasant manner , creditable to all parties , what might otherwise . remain a source of grief and dissatisfaction . I am , yours fraternally and truly . October 27 th , 1863 . AN OM MASON .

TO THE EDITOR OP THE FREEMASON'S' MAGAZINE AUD aiASOSTC IHRROH . DEAR SIR AND BROTHER , —In reply to "P . M ., " whose letter appeared in the number for October 24 th , I beg to say that I was not actually or apparently pub forth as ¦ a scout . " P . M . " has alluded to me under the signature I appended to my note , and it is quite as far from my wish as it can be to his to bandwords with him .

y My forbearance teaches me to overlook his rudeness , but I claim to call things by their right names with ¦ quite as much vigour as he does , and it appeared to me that Lodge 600 and its Treasurer had been , and still are , treated very unfairly . As a London brother , never having been in the town in which Lodge 600 meets , knowing no brother who is ,

or ever was , to my knowledge , one of its members , I can he no scout—no tool of those of whom I know nothing . My signature expressed my feelings on the matter , and I can only regret that a brother can be found who fieems desirous of withholding from those who conscientiously differ from him that which should be extended to both sides of a question . FAIR PLAY .

Can A Warden Initiate, &C. ?

CAN A WARDEN INITIATE , & c . ?

TO THE EDITOR OP THE PREEStASOUS JTAGAZIJTE AUD 3 IASOUIO MIRROR . DEAR SIR AND BROTHER , —Bro . William Blackburn ' s questions aud assertions , intended to be looked upon as unanswerable , prove too much for his case . In " 161 . 6 , there were two Masonic jurisdictions in England . That at York—thc elder sister—styled the Grand Lodge of ¦ all England , had lodges , holding under it , sparsely

scattered throughout the land , whilst the other ruling power was an occasional aud fitful Grand Master in the South , having no Grand Lodge , but regarded by various isolated lodges as their head . The regulanions of these two systems were as widely different as their respective governments . The Union in 1813 did all that Bro . Blackburn claims

for it , and something more into the bargain , when it proceeded to " alter , repeal , and abrogate all past regulations , " yet retaining as one of its fundamentals the principle enunciated by the Southern Grand Lodge , in 1723 , " that it is not in the power of any man , or body of men , to make innovation in the body of Masonry : " so that even Bro . Blackburn must admit that to " alter ,

repeal , and abrogate all past regulations" was as great an innovation , aud thorough clean sweep , as any body of men could possibly make either iu the body or spirit of Freemasonry . Of course , a different individual cannot answer Avhether another is sure or not about any point unless they have compared notesbut Bro . Blackburn treats the

, Athol and York lodges as synonymous , and actually places the junior first . The York lodge was founded about A . D . 928 , and the Athol lodges were York lodges , but never termed so until the Duke of Athol accepted the Grand Mastership o £ tho " Ancient Masons" in the

year 1772 , and resigned it to the Duke of Kent on the 1 st of December , 1813 , in order that the latter should , iu his turn , abdicate to the Duke of Sussex on the following St . John ' s day , the 27 th of December , in the same year . Bro . Blackburn cannot be complimented on his knowledge of comparative philology , for the word " Warden" is

nob Anglo-Saxon , or Saxon , but pure low Dutch , waerden , " a keeper , a guardian , a head officer , " and in no one ease does his definition of an irresponsible head apply to a Warden , who was the chief executive officer under the head . Old Oowel tells us that "the Warden of the Cinque Ports is a magistrate of those havens in the east of England , called the Oinque Ports , who has there all

that jurisdiction which the Admiral of England has in places not exempt "—and this was by no means , at any time , to be likened to the kingly power . Without entering into the question of what the "Book of Constitutions" indicates as to the duties and privileges of Wardens—one sentence by Bro , Blackburn disposes of his entire argument . He writes , " Where a Fellow Craftsman is chosen Warden of the work under

the Master , he shall be true both to Master and Fellows , shall carefully oversee the work in the Master ' s absence , " & c . " Here , " says Bro . Blackburn , " is nothing about taking an apprentice only as to ' the management of the Craft in working , ' id . est , work already in hand ; and in that sense only may a Warden rule a lodge at the present day . " Surely Bro . Blackburn ' s gloss on the passage

above quoted is fatal to his argument , for if a Warden has the power to complete the work already in hand , he must be able to initiate . An imaginary case , but founded on those of daily occurrence , will show how untenable Bro . Blackburn ' s doctrine is . A lodge is summoned—the W . M . is absent , it then falls to the lot of one of the Wardens to preside . There is an initiation , a passing , and

a raising , to be performed . Well , says Bro . Blackburn , he can'ttake anapprentioe ; all he can do is to rule the lodge as far as the work already in hand goes . But the work in hand comprises conferring the second and third degrees , and does Bro . Blackburn mean to say a Warden can admit brethren to an equal status with himself , oiS . ce of course exceptedand not be able to receive a candidate ?

, Is there any secret that a W . M . can communicate to an E . A ., F . C , or M . M . that caunot be done as well by a Warden of equal ability ? Or , again , to what can an installing W . M . or P . M . allude when he says , in his address to the Wardens , " in his [ the newly installed W . M . ' sJabsence you will succeed to higher duties ; your

attainments , therefore , should be of such a nature , that the brethren may not suffer for want of proper instruction . " And what instruction is half so proper or profitable to the brethren of a lodge than to see the three degrees performed ? Therefore , if a Warden can pass and raise brethren to superior degrees , it is a manifest absurdity to contend he cannot confer the first aud lowest degree .

Bro . Blackburn then quotes the following declaration : — " The Grand Lodge al « ne has the inherent power of enacting laws and regulations for the government of the Craft , and of altering , repealing , and abrogating them ; ahvays taking care that the ancient landmarks of the Order be preserved . " He then adds , " I call upon the members of Grand Lodge to take that care . " "Our

duty is not to inquire what wove the practices in 1646 , 1682 , 1725 , or any period anterior to the ' solemn act of union between the two Grand Lodges of Freemasons of England , in December , 1813 , but to transmit to our successors the ancient landmarks of the Order , ' and ' the laws and regulations for the government of the Craft , ' and unsullied as we have received them . "

pure Granting Bro . Blackburn ' s citation to be correct ,- as an extract , how can the ancient landmarks be preserved if they have been , as he tells us at the beginning of his letter they were , —altered , repealed , and abrogated ? If we are not to inquire what they were , how can we observe them ? Or in what maimer cau they be transmitted pure

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